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The Panel

Justin Jackson & Brian Casel

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When it comes to bootstrapping and building software, there's rarely one right answer. We want to dive into the nuance. In every episode, veteran founders Justin Jackson and Brian Casel bring together a panel of sharp minds from the indie tech world to tackle thorny topics – from pricing and product strategy to work-life balance. No gurus, no easy answers – just real conversations we'd normally have behind closed doors.
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Developer Experience is a podcast brought to you by Algolia. We chat with guests who build products for developers about their developer experience strategy, what it means for them and why it’s important.
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The Undefined Podcast

Jared Palmer & Ken Wheeler

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The only engineering podcast with a 2 drink minimum! Full stack developers Jared Palmer and Ken Wheeler have peer-to-peer conversations with world-class engineers about software development.
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Adam Wathan sat down with Justin and Brian to talk about the challenge of staying motivated with your own business, even when you've "made it." However successful you think a well-known product or founder might be, the truth is everyone's dealing with stresses and challenges and things that don't work and figuring out what to do next. That's what t…
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Aaron is joined this week by Adam Wathan to talk about everything from Disney Cruises to what he wants to do on YouTube and a whole lot more. Sponsored by Bento and WorkOS. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - The Disney Debate (03:27) - Zero MRR (05:15) - YouTube Stuff (13:…
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Ian and Aaron are joined by Taylor Otwell to discuss the Mostly Technical Party at Laracon, what exactly Taylor does on a day-to-day basis, how they all use AI, and so much more. Sponsored by Bento, WorkOS, Native PHP for Mobile, and Laracon US 2025 Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more…
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Jordan Gal is breaking the mold with his new startup Rosie. He's targeting non-technical small business owners using consumer-style marketing rather than the B2B approaches most SaaS use. He talks about the opportunities and risks with AI-based startups, and how he's waiting for the "dam to break." Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (03:42) - Using what I…
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Ian and Aaron discuss their respective trips to Vegas and Miami, Aaron's latest video, making new friends in real life, & more. Sponsored by Bento, WorkOS, Native PHP for Mobile, and Laracon US 2025 Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Back from Vegas (17:26) - Marker 237 (1…
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Ian and Aaron discuss upcoming travel to Miami & Vegas, Aaron's new 'Dead Drop" command, the future of Fusion, & more. Sponsored by Bento, WorkOS, Native PHP for Mobile, and Laracon US 2025 Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Rebounding (11:46) - Heading To React Miami (16:…
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Ian and Aaron discuss Ian's trip to PHP x NYC, Aaron's new art, how to try to thrive if you think a recession is coming, and so much more. Sponsored by Bento and WorkOS. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - A Billionaire Sighting (06:22) - PHP × NYC (14:25) - Follow Up (18:2…
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Recorded live after PHP × NYC with Ben Holmen, John Drexler, Daniel Coulbourne, Chris Morrell, Ian Landsman, Dave Hicking, and Joe Tannenbaum. Considering we're all podcasters, we decided to sit down and discuss the most important issues of the day: Trader Joe's in basements, Poker, Day 2 Soup, Chess.com, something called "The Pizza Belt", and so m…
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Ian and Aaron discuss Ian's trip to Disney World, Aaron's adventures with Reddit & Hacker News, building a new billing system, and so much more. Sponsored by Bento, Stream, Laravel Cloud, and PHP Tek 2025. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Disney World (17:01) - Follow Up…
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Brian Casel hosts a candid conversation with Val Sopi and Christian Genco about the realities of launching new SaaS products in 2025. All three founders are at pivotal moments in their entrepreneurial journeys, wrestling with what products to build next, how to balance consulting work with product development, and finding the elusive "founder-produ…
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Aaron is joined this week by Jordan Gal (Ian's off at Disney World) to discuss everything from finding product market fit for his new product Rosie to the Try Hard business model and so much more. Sponsored by Bento, Stream, Laravel Cloud, and PHP Tek 2025. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to le…
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Ian and Aaron talk about scheduling your day, Aaron's newsletter, setting big goals, and a whole more. Sponsored by Bento, Stream, Laravel Cloud, and PHP Tek 2025. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. Links: Chris Morrell on Bluesky Steve Carell with gray hair 'What Is The Cosmere?' J…
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Marie Poulin and Aaron Francis join us to discuss the realities of building creator-driven businesses. We talked a lot about YouTube (they describe how each got traction there) and their current video making process. They also challenged conventional wisdom about sticking to one niche. For them, pivoting between projects keeps them fresh and preven…
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Ian and Aaron discuss Aaron's viral tweet, more problems with HVAC, accountability for your own time, and so much more. Sponsored by Bento, Stream, Laravel Cloud, and PHP Tek 2025. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Video Game Historian (14:01) - Do Up A Prototype (19:38) …
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Ian and Aaron discuss Aaron's day off, 90s news anchors, Laravel's Big Day, and so much more. Sponsored by Bento, Moonbase Labs, and Packetly. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. Links: First Watch Aaron's tweet about news Peter Jennings Calvin and Hobbes "Hang a Lantern" Laravel Shi…
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Peldi is the founder of Balsamiq and pioneered transparent business building in 2007. In this episode, he came to the Panel looking advice on "build in public." We invited Jay Clouse, of Creator Science, on to share his wisdom. Jay had tons of practical suggestions for SaaS founders looking to build community and build in public in an authentic way…
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Ian and Aaron discuss why Aaron needs a hobby, HelpSpot's new logo & 20 year (!) revenue graph, microwave power settings, the release of Fusion, and so much more. Sponsored by Bento, Moonbase Labs, and Packetly. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. Links: Fusion Backstage Pass Taylor'…
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Ian and Aaron discuss the release date of Fusion, winning money at poker, ideas for Laracon swag jackets, and a whole lot more. Sponsored by Bento, Moonbase Labs, and Packetly. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. Links: Disney Springs The Wizarding World of Harry Potter Factorio Pot-…
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Is web development still a good career choice in 2025? What's the future of open source? Justin and Brian dive deep with Taylor Otwell (Laravel) and Caleb Porzio (Livewire, Alpine.js, Flux) about the state of web dev, building a business on open source, and the anxiety of managing competition. Chapters: (03:31) - Should people still pursue web deve…
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Ian and Aaron discuss all things related to AI, Ian's new thing he built, a Rails course, and more. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://sponsor.mostlytechnical.com to learn more. (00:00) - Sleep Talk (04:00) - Ian Built Something (17:05) - Let's Talk AI (44:45) - There's A New Superm…
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Is bootstrapping a SaaS dead in 2025? How will AI affect software development as an industry? What's working when it comes to marketing? Justin Jackson (Transistor.fm) and Brian Casel (Instrumental Products) are joined by Colleen Schnettler (SaaS Marketing Gym) and Tyler King (Less Annoying CRM) to debate our predictions for the new year. CHAPTERS:…
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Ian and Aaron discuss the importance of seeing your friends in person, why Blade needs to be as fast as possible, weapons grade social media, conferences, and a lot more. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - What's The Good Word? (1…
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Ian & Aaron talk about Aaron's upcoming JS library, a new course idea, "AI Aaron Francis", Disney Adults, and a lot more. Sponsored by LaraJobs, & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Body Talk (05:18) - Ready For 2025 (19:20) - Long Plays (28:10) - New Co…
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When it comes to bootstrapping and building software, there's rarely one correct answer. The secret to building better products, profitable companies, and a better life is knowing how to find the best answer for you. That’s the purpose of The Panel podcast. Join hosts Justin (Transistor.fm) and Brian Casel (Instrumental Products) in each episode as…
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Ian and Aaron discuss Aaron's TUI app, what it's like being a founder over 40, "the drones", and so much more. Sponsored by LaraJobs, Screencasting.com, and CodeRabbit Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Founders Over Forty (10:54) - It's Gonna Be Bad (15:25) - Watch Guy (2…
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Ian and Aaron talk about everything from Interstellar to the Late Night Wars of the 90s to speaking at conferences to maybe the greatest question of the week: what do you want to do when you retire? Sponsored by LaraJobs, Screencasting.com, and CodeRabbit Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to lear…
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Bootstrapping a business is like getting a plane to lift off the ground. But what do you do once the plane is in the air? Dave Giunta and Justin Jackson recorded a recent phone call about maintaining motivation after the initial startup phase. How does founder energy shift once you've achieved your early goals? Dave prods Justin to find new sources…
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Ian and Aaron go in-depth on Aaron's highly anticipated arrival on Bluesky - what's good, what's bad, and why he doesn't like when people tell him he's using it wrong. Plus an update on ads, a big garage idea, and more. Sponsored by LaraJobs, Screencasting.com, Mailtrap, and Mailcoach. Use code MOSTLYTECHNICAL to get 3 free months when signing up f…
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Ian and Aaron discuss feedback on ads for the podcast, what the heck Ian does every day, updates on the Try Hard empire, & so much more. Sponsored by Mailtrap, LaraJobs, & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Vibes From The People (09:03) - What Does Ian E…
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Ian and Aaron are back this week to discuss Aaron's adventures with the terminal, Ian's ideas for the future of Mostly Technical, a trip to Boise, and so much more. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Airing of the Grievances (09:2…
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Ian is joined by Caleb Porzio and we talk about recent consumer product acquisitions, a dive deep into Flux's multi-select and more advanced components like charts, and we do a Business Dad corner about hiring. * Joel Spolsky on how to find great developers (A little dated, but still good)By Ian Landsman and Aaron Francis
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Ian's joined by Matt Swanson while Aaron is out ✂️. We cover the forgotten victims of the Wordpress drama like Gravatar and Day One, if a bootstrapper should be happy about $10k/mrr and make the case for jobs as being good, should the government sell ads on the Penny, and "things Aaron should do". Don't miss our bonus Youtube video this week as wel…
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Ian and Aaron discuss Aaron's trip to San Francisco, Bluesky vs. Twitter, and why Ian's not doing his secret side project plus our tier rankings for...pizza toppings?! Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. Links: Amoxicillin Sanity Web Dev Cha…
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Ian and Aaron discuss updates on Aaron's house, the Try Hard Factory, his course launch, and so much more. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Mostly Arguing About Mars (08:54) - House Update (20:27) - Francis Real Estate Empire (3…
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Ian and Aaron discuss everything from Aaron's dream for a Try Hard Factory to Ian being unimpressed with SpaceX rockets to the biggest question of all - what do you want to do with your life? Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Ter…
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Ian and Aaron reunite to talk about bad design, WordPress drama, Aaron's secret physical product, why you want to be liquid, and more. Sponsored by LaraJobs, Screencasting.com, and Mailcoach. Use code MOSTLYTECHNICAL to get 3 free months when signing up for Mailcoach. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sp…
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Ian is joined this week by Jack McDade, creator of Statamic, and a motley crew (John O'Nolan, Caleb Porzio, and Adam Wathan) to discuss what the future of Statamic might look like. Should the price change? Should it be open source? Who should it be marketed at? Does Statamic need an enterprise offering? All that & a ton more. Sponsored by LaraJobs …
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Ian and Aaron are joined this week by Caleb Porzio (friend of the show) on our very first live stream in honor of Flux, which Caleb literally launches live on the podcast. Plus everything from password hygiene to cloud exits to hiring people to, of course, all the ups & downs of launching a product like Flux. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.c…
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Ian is back (!) with Aaron to check in about what happened to Ian's gallbladder, Aaron's announcement video, dreaming big, and so much more. Sponsored by LaraJobs, Screencasting.com, and Mailcoach. Use code MOSTLYTECHNICAL to get 3 free months when signing up for Mailcoach. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.…
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Aaron is joined this week once again by Caleb Porzio to discuss everything that happened at Laracon (including a basketball game?!) before diving deep into Flux, the online reaction to the price, and what comes next. Sponsored by LaraJobs, Screencasting.com, and Mailcoach. Use code MOSTLYTECHNICAL to get 3 free months when signing up for MailCoach.…
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Aaron is joined this week by Caleb Porzio (back-to-back weeks!) and Daniel Coulbourne (first-time guest!) to dive deep into prep for Laracon, text editors, something called the "side eye verify", Aaron's recent blog post, and a whole lot more. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://most…
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Aaron is joined this week by special guest Caleb Porzio (filling in for Ian) to talk about everything from solo parenting to Caleb's new project to rejuvenating Torchlight and a lot more. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Low Ene…
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Ian and Aaron check in about everything from tacos in NY to Twitter vs. Threads plus how Aaron found his next Linda, Aaron's new video series, & more. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Ian's Trying Obsidian (14:23) - Life OS Upda…
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Ian and Aaron talk about the investment that got away, why Try Hard is a media company, bringing back the forum, and an incredible idea for a new contest. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - Kubera (03:01) - Do It For The Content (…
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Ian and Aaron talk about Ian's new idea that's got him frazzled and on tilt, Aaron's sales milestone, the game Factorio, and a lot more. Sponsored by LaraJobs & Screencasting.com. Interested in sponsoring Mostly Technical? Head to https://mostlytechnical.com/sponsor to learn more. (00:00) - I'm Very Tilted (13:19) - Know A Guy (19:31) - Course Upda…
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