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Things Musicians Don't Talk About

Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca Toal

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Hattie Butterworth and Rebecca Toal host a podcast of insight and change in the classical music and arts professions. Delving into the often stigmatised worlds of mental health, injury, discrimination and productivity, classical music issues are spoken and revived. Join Hattie, Rebecca and guests for important conversations, inspiring moments of wisdom and poignant vulnerability. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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Our aim as musicians is to communicate generously and freely to our audience but we rarely turn towards ourselves with the same degree of care. In this meditation, Ruth Philips leads a loving kindness practice, exploring how it might be to extend that kindness outwards towards our audience Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information…
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This meditation aims to bring you closer to your instrument and aid in healing any sense of disconnect you may be feeling Discover Ruth Philips *Ruth Philips and Lucy Russell are running a course 'Mindfulness for Musicians' at Benslow Music from 13-15 June. More information here* ------------------------------------------------------------- Things …
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A meditation for musicians lead by cellist and mindfulness meditation teacher Ruth Philips for use to calm the mind around stage fright and performance anxiety. Discover Ruth Philips ------------------------------------------------------------- Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram…
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'On returning from America, I listened back to lots of my old recordings and discovered a paradox: I had no confidence but also thought I deserved more – thought I was better than I really was'. Hattie sits down to share reflections from her trip to America from health anxiety and Curtis, to self-love and deleting dating apps Hosted on Acast. See a…
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This week we interview trumpet player Lucy Humphris about her journey through music college and the contemporary music scene. We speak about the institutional barriers Lucy and others face as a female brass player with a non-traditional career trajectory, sharing her experiences of feeling "othered" and misunderstood. From battling expectations of …
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Eating disorders and intense practice obsession have a lot in common. How do we move from an 'all or nothing' mindset to something structured and regular? Becca shares the start to her return to exercise following healing from an eating disorder and Hattie shares the parallels to the toxic relationship she has to the cello and hours of practice Hos…
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There are statements made time and time again when you approach the topic of women in music: 'but historically music by men is just better', 'I'm sick of this wokeism in classical music' and 'people won't buy tickets to concerts of just women's music'. CN Lester and Gillian Moore join us live at the Royal Society of Musicians to unpack these statem…
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10 years ago trombonist Emily White lost her husband after a prolonged period of illness. She was thrown into the worlds of death admin and loneliness, but out of it discovered a perspective on what was important as a musician. She shares with Hattie and Becca an insight into her grief journey, as well as her infectious joy of teaching and hatred o…
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Is capitalism to blame for the mental health crisis? Should we separate the art from the artist? Rebecca and Hattie have been reading non-fiction. And they are sharing two of the books with each other. Naomi Klein's Doppelganger won the Women's Prize for Non-Fiction in 2024 and has had a strong impact since it hit the bookshelves. The pressure for …
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Mark Brierley came to the world of classical music via journalism and without any prior knowledge of the industry. Now, as Head of Membership and Communications at the Royal Society of Musicians, he spends every day hearing from musicians about the reality of their lives. He speaks with Hattie at the RSM headquarters about the origins of the 'Fund …
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It's Becca's turn to sit down for a solo check in with the help of some listener questions. The grief journey continues, as does the freelancing, and Becca reflects on emotional regulation, balancing her various jobs, and processing the death of an abuser. Things Musicians Don't Talk About is now supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow …
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We asked Linton Stephens to come and speak about authenticity for our first live show at the Royal Society of Musicians. A musician and broadcaster who has been naturally unapologetic about his identity in all corners of his career, living authentically is just part of Linton's everyday. But classical music's fragility means that this type of openn…
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Back in February we talked with the legend, Jalayne Mitchell. It was such a special episode that we had to keep it brewing for many, many months. Jalayne has since taken a break from Classical Wellness but her message is still so vital and timely. We talk about starting an instrument 'late' and playing catch up, starting a bold project outside the …
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CW: death; brief mention of disordered eating What happens when someone dies? How do you talk to someone who's lost a parent? What's wrong with the word 'talent'? Do you take on work that makes you uncomfortable? Why are we so scared of Freshers Week? We answer all these questions with absolute authority this week on Things Musicians Don't Talk Abo…
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When cellist Matthew Barley was 16 he tried to take his own life following a drug-induced psychotic episode. He then went on to channel everything into music until in 2019 the trauma of the event resurfaced. We speak to Matthew about his experience of psychosis, looking back on his experiences and the process of trauma therapy and the impact of aya…
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This was a big one for Things Musicians Don't Talk About: our first live show!!!! We are so grateful to the London Podcast Festival for inviting us to take the stage with the exceptional Ayanna Witter-Johnson. Hattie and Becca talked a little bit about the conception of the podcast and their own mental health journeys, and then chatted with Ayanna …
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We're back with our first interview after the summer! The brilliant Laure Chan speaks with Hattie and Becca about her cross-cultural, genre-bending creative endeavours and her journey to musical authenticity. How did Laure get into composing whilst already being an established violinist? How does she explore her own identity through the medium of m…
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Trigger warning: eating disorders, weight (no specific numbers) A different format of episode this week! Becca reads out her latest blog on her body, her identity and her fears about the possibility of a life of ‘sizing-up’. She answers some questions afterwards about the blog, talking about the male gaze, the concept of numbers in recovery and the…
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Reflecting on recent trips back to our former music schools and colleges, we chat about the complex emotions that arise when revisiting places of past trauma. We discuss the challenges of addressing mental health in educational settings, wondering if our message is relevant to current students, and the lasting impact of architecture and locations o…
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When cellist Ruth Philips was 29 and studying in America, she left her room as she wanted it to be found after her death. So certain was she that the performance approaching her would be the end of her life. Now, Ruth is sought after for her whole, integrative approach as a cello teacher, mindfulness practitioner and performance coach. She speaks t…
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We thought we'd celebrate hitting 3,000 Instagram followers as some sort of milestone in this crazy journey to cultivate much-needed honesty in the music industry! Every follower, every listener we connect with feels like a little headway in making change in the culture. In this episode, we take some time to look back on our podcast journey so far,…
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In this episode of Things Musicians Don't Talk About, Becca sits down with Chloé van Soeterstède in her dressing room at the Royal College of Music. Chloé shares her personal experiences of working as a musician alongside pregnancy and then motherhood. She walks us through her journey - from figuring out with her manager when might be the best time…
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Another chatty episode for you lovely lot! This was recorded for our last Voices radio slot in February 2023. Hattie and Becca chat about queerness in classical music, exploring our opinions on the films Tár and Maestro, and how we feel power dynamics and hero-worship were portrayed in them. As we've seen over the past few decade or so, teacher-stu…
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This week we come to you (unintentionally) from the Royal Opera House! We speak with composer, theatre-maker, and journalist Zygmund de Somogyi about growing up with Autism Spectrum Disorder, not fitting in to the classical music world, discovering the world of composing, their experiences of imposter syndrome and feeling disconnected from the worl…
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TW: sexual assault we do discuss an experience of sexual assault/harassment about halfway through the episode so feel free to skip through / give this one a miss <3 We recorded this episode as part of our Voices Radio residency after the hazy summer of 2023. We took a break from the podcast for a couple of months and reflect on our individual exper…
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A very Happy New Year from us at TMDTA! To kick off 2024, we have an episode recorded waaaaay back last year with the joyous James Partridge. We speak to him about his very unique career, bringing 'primary school bangers' to the masses and what life is like as a social media sensation. Why do these primary school hymns unlock 100% FEELS in us and w…
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On our Voices Radio slot this month, Becca interviewed DJ Jess Hands about her experiences with mental illness and how making music has been a healing distraction from her struggles. We hear her honest account of what it's like to go through mental health crises, bipolar disorder and to get to grips with simultaneously working as a DJ. Jessica's bi…
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Welcome back! This week we speak with astounding trumpet soloist, Simon Höfele, taking a peek behind the scenes of his stunning international career to discuss the reality of it all. We chat about Simon's fortunate journey to becoming a soloist and how his ultimate love is for creating music (especially the contemporary kind), using the trumpet as …
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Composer Gavin Higgins found that music was the only thing calmed his severe facial tics as a young kid. After an assessment at the Maudsley Hospital, Gavin was diagnosed with Tourettes and Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. He was put on Prozac and told to snap a rubber band on his wrist to take away his intrusive thoughts. A lot has changed in the tr…
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It's our first sneaky peaky Patreon preview! Welcome through this little creaky door in the paywall to hear 5 minutes of exclusive content that we recorded last Halloween! In this episode, Hattie, Katy and Becca scare the living daylights outta themselves by reading feedback ranging from grade 8 to graduate scheme rejections. We also have a little …
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This episode is dedicated to Koshka’s wonderful piano teacher, Niel Immelman, who sadly passed away since it was recorded - and who made it all possible. TW// sexual violence and assault, physical assault, police brutality Becca first came across today's guest when she stumbled upon her collection of essays, Abolishing the Police. Philosophy profes…
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For TMDTA's July Voices Radio appearance, Hattie and Becca discuss Lewis Capaldi's Glastonbury set and how this might translate in the classical music world. They also chat about their experiences of saying no as employees and as freelancers, Hattie's new adventures on bass guitar and Becca's new therapist. In the original show, the first half of P…
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Our amazing friend, trumpeter Aaron Akugbo, is about to make his BBC Proms debut with the Chineke! Orchestra - but there's more to his story. Determined to be unapologetic about his identity, Aaron takes us through the weird world of brass 'lad' culture, through to the rise of Black Lives Matter and navigating the brass world as someone facing dire…
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Becca catches up with her former teacher, Paul Denegri, from his stay in an old farmhouse. The humblest of the humble, Paul takes us through his journey to where he is now: revisiting his unexpected appointment as Head of Brass at Wells Cathedral School; his feelings of imposter syndrome and disillusionment with the freelance musician lifestyle; an…
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Things Musicians Don't Talk About is now generously supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! The Royal Society of Musicians is Britain’s oldest music charity and our aims remain as relevant today as they were in the earliest years – to provide vital financial assistance, advice and guidance to those professionally active in the world of music b…
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Tw: Mentions of suicide and it’s prevention In a society opening up conversations around mental health, suicide is still severely stigmatised and misunderstood. Today we meet pianist Gosia Garska who volunteers at the Listening Place - a charity set up to hold space for people struggling with suicidal thoughts and ideation. We discuss common myths …
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WE PASSED OUR VOICES RADIO TRIAL! Here's our most recent episode-show where we answer beautiful questions from our Insta followers (thanks you guys!). We chit-chat about our favourite and least favourite memories of TMDTA, Father Christmas and Wendy Christmas, a slightly different origin story of the podcast, the power of sharing our stories on soc…
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This week we speak with the inspiring Emily Ashton, baroque cellist, viola da gambist and climate activist. Emily is a founding member of XR Baroque, a group of early music environmentalists who perform at Extinction Rebellion protests. We discuss how we process the overwhelm and anxiety that come with thinking about climate change, the murkiness o…
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On this episode, Hattie speaks with flautist Kathryn Williams, co-author of the Independent Society of Musicians's (ISM) Dignity at Work 2 study, which looked into the experiences of discrimination among those working in the music sector. They also speak about Kathryn's experiences as a single parent 11 years ago, navigating studying at the Royal N…
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In this episode of Things Musicians Don't Talk About, Hattie and Becca chat from the cosiness of Hattie's new-ish house and perfect podcasting room. We have a candid conversation about the recent arts cuts and the precarity of freelancing, plus Becca's recent feelings of audition burnout, and how we've both experienced and dealt with (or not dealt …
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Where do musicians go for support in a crisis? For many years Help Musicians UK has been the main source of advocacy, funding and research for musicians facing crises of health and finances in the UK. In response to the increase in need for mental health support post pandemic, last autumn Help Musicians launched its subsidiary charity, Music Minds …
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Today we are coming with a fascinating episode with Ingela Onstad, who is a psychotherapist and performance coach, as well as a professional soprano. Both Rebecca and I have been interested in getting to know a musician who is also trained as a psychotherapist and were curious to understand how she deals with boundaries in her job. We explore all o…
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***This episode deals covers topics including eating disorders, mental illness and the Holocaust. Kate talks about them incredibly respectfully and not in graphic details, but for listeners that would rather sit this one out, we understand*** It's our last episode of 2022 and this time, we're speaking to the exceptional Dr. Kate Kennedy, broadcaste…
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This week we are coming from a North London living room with our wonderful friends from Three In A Bar Podcast. Verity Simmons (cello) and Seb Philpott (trumpet) join us for a 2-part series of collaborative podcasting and incredible company. We talk about how podcasting has altered their lives, who writes the emails, their careers and experiences a…
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Introducing our producer, the wonderful flautist Katy Ehrlich. We are so excited to introduce Katy to you all and for you to hear the journey of her incredible life, and role in the pod, through county youth orchestra to Manchester University and then to the Royal Academy of Music for masters. Katy's journey uncovers a lot of the difficulties with …
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‘It’s easy to slip into a mode of being where you think your life is happening to you and you’re stuck…you think you have to carry on xyz trajectory because that’s how it’s been for so long…’ This week’s guest is the soprano Betty Makharinsky who spoke to me (Hattie) during a day of rehearsals for the charity and organisation she co-founded, Vache …
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This episode we are sharing the space with BBC Radio 3 presenter and flautist, Hannah French. Recorded in a North London office space, we listened as Hannah explained to us her journey to a diagnosis of Ehlers Danlos Syndrome, a collagen deficiency which affects the soft tissue and has impacted her ability to walk, play the flute and live life as s…
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This week on TMDTA, Becca and Hattie chat with Guy Withers, Artistic Director, founder and CEO of Waterperry Opera Festival, about this year's upcoming festival which will celebrate it's fifth anniversary with an innovative eight-day open-air collection of eight productions in Waterperry, Oxfordshire. As usual, Becca and Hattie want to know more ab…
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