Description:In this Road Tripping episode, Jen is joined by one of her dearest friends — the brilliant and beloved author and interviewer, Kelly Corrigan. Kelly read Awake cover to cover (twice!) and came armed to the live Awake Book Tour event in Denver, Colorado with ten of her favorite lines from the book, inviting Jen to riff on each one in real time. What unfolds is a night of belly laughs, truth-telling, and deep reflection on faith, patriarchy, divorce, parenting adult kids, therapy, rebuilding your life, and why middle age is actually the most freeing chapter yet.

This conversation is Jen and Kelly at their absolute best: funny, wise, irreverent, and wide open.

• Growing up inside patriarchal faith systems and the lifelong impact of being taught not to trust your own intuition

• Why Jen believes that curiosity has never led her wrong — but that certainty has led her down many dead ends

• The moment that Jen realized the patriarchy harms everyone, including the men and boys she loves

• How purity culture can shape (and warp) our early ideas about sex, marriage, and womanhood

• Parenting through divorce and the shift from coaching to comforting

• Therapy breakthroughs around conflict, attachment styles, codependency, and dropping the need to control others’ emotions

Thought-provoking Quotes:

• “Curiosity has never led me wrong. Certainty has led me down so many dead ends.” —Jen Hatmaker

• “Patriarchy messed both of us up. Neither one of us was meant to live inside those roles.” —Jen Hatmaker

• “When you try to rush your kids through their hard feelings, they feel abandoned. Comfort over coaching — that’s where we live.” —Jen Hatmaker

• “I’m not your leader. I’m your sister. This book isn’t a prescription. It’s my story handed to you with open hands.” —Jen Hatmaker

• “Sometimes the worst thing that ever happens ends up becoming the best thing. Not because of the pain — but because of the life that blooms afterward.” —Jen Hatmaker

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

• Awake: A Memoir by Jen Hatmaker – https://amzn.to/440b5YW

• Tell Me More: Stories About the 12 Hardest Things I'm Learning to Say by Kelly Corrigan – https://amzn.to/4an9rUX

• The Middle Place by Kelly Corrigan – https://amzn.to/49Xueyt

• Kelly Corrigan Wonders podcast – https://www.kellycorrigan.com/podcast

• Who Is Government?: The Untold Story of Public Service by Michael Lewis – https://amzn.to/4pLC3Md

Guest’s Links:

Website - https://www.kellycorrigan.com/

Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/kellycorrigan

Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/kelly.corrigan.376

Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@kellycorriganvideo

Podcast - https://www.kellycorrigan.com/podcast

Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/

Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/

Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.

Listen in as Jen and Kelly discuss:

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