How do multinational consulting firms enable state capture? In this episode, regular KB host Liz David-Barrett chats with Devi Pillay about her research on the role of McKinsey & Co.'s involvement in the capture of South Africa under President Zuma. Drawing on evidence from the Zondo Commission, Devi describes how consulting firms worked with politically connected local partners to extract billions in fees from state-owned enterprises, while providing misleading advice that facilitated further corruption. Liz and Devi also discuss the vital role of investigative journalists and whistleblowers in exposing these arrangements, the devastating impact on South Africa's infrastructure and economy, and the mixed accountability outcomes for the firms involved. Find Devi Pillay’s working paper for GI ACE here: https://giace.org/resources/consulting-firms-corruption-and-state-capture/ Find similar themes on South Africa's state capture in episode 129. This research is part of the Governance & Integrity Anti-Corruption Evidence (GI ACE) programme which generates actionable evidence that policymakers, practitioners and advocates can use to design and implement more effective anti-corruption initiatives. This GI ACE project is funded by UK International Development. The views expressed in this report do not necessarily reflect the UK Government’s official policies.