In this Season 14 review (episode 376) Andrea Samadi revisits highlights from her interview with Dr. John Ratey about the science of exercise, nutrition, and social connection for brain health and longevity.

The episode explains Peter Attia's rule for foundational fitness, warns against sugar dependence and fat phobia, and presents the three biggest levers for healthy aging: exercise, diet, and social connection, plus practical tips to track and apply these habits.

Takeaway: prioritize consistent movement, whole foods, and meaningful connection to boost mood, memory, and overall well-being.

On today's episode #376, we review PART 2 of our 2021 interview with Dr. John Ratey and will learn:

✔ 3 Science-backed keys to brain health: Exercise, Nutrition and Connection

✔ What is Attia's Rule that allows us to dive deep into diet and nutrition?

✔ Practical Tips for improving consistent movement, our diet and social connection to boost overall well-being and brain health.

Welcome back to SEASON 14 of The Neuroscience Meets Social and Emotional Learning Podcast, where we connect the science-based evidence behind social and emotional learning and emotional intelligence training for improved well-being, achievement, productivity and results—using what I saw as the missing link (since we weren’t taught this when we were growing up in school), the application of practical neuroscience.

I’m Andrea Samadi, and seven years ago, launched this podcast with a question I had never truly asked myself before: (and that is) If productivity and results matter to us—and they do now more than ever—how exactly are we using our brain to make them happen?

Most of us were never taught how to apply neuroscience to improve productivity, results, or well-being. About a decade ago, I became fascinated by the mind-brain-results connection—and how science can be applied to our everyday lives.

That’s why I’ve made it my mission to bring you the world’s top experts—so together, we can explore the intersection of science and social-emotional learning. We’ll break down complex ideas and turn them into practical strategies we can use every day for predictable, science-backed results.

Episode 376: PART 2 Featuring Dr. John Ratey

For today’s Episode 376, we continue with PART 2 of our review with Dr. John Ratey, covering the first health staple that we know is scientifically proven to boost our physical and mental health: exercise. We first met Dr. Ratey on Episode 116[i] (back in March 2021) on his book “The Revolutionary New Science of Exercise and the Brain.” Dr. Ratey is also an Associate Clinical Professor of Psychiatry at Harvard Medical School and an internationally recognized expert in Neuropsychiatry.

Dr. Ratey has published over 60 peer-reviewed articles and 11 books in 17 languages.

You’ll notice that around the time of the pandemic, in 2020, our interviews took a turn towards health and wellness, and to stay on track, I created a framework of our Top 5 Health Staples on Episode 87[ii], which eventually evolved into our Top 6 Health Staples.

🎧 Listen to Episode 87: The Top 5 Brain Health and Alzheimer’s Prevention Strategies[iii]

🌐 Learn more about Dr. Ratey: www.johnratey.com

We also did a Deep Dive into Dr. Ratey’s books

🎧 Listen to Episode 118[iv]:

A Deep Dive into Dr. Ratey’s books, Spark, Go Wild and Driven to Distraction.

Before we go into Dr. Ratey’s first clip, with the thoughts of debating diet plans or supplements, (a broad and deep topic) Dr. Peter Attia[v] the author of the book The Science and Art of Longevity suggests we first get our “exercise house in order.” He argues that until we can do the following, our time is better spent building foundational fitness. For those of us who want to dive into this topic, he asks us to do the following, which has been coined as: Attia’s Rule.

Dead hang for 1 minute Wall sit for 2 minutes Deadlift your body weight for 10 reps Achieve a VO₂ max at or above the 75th percentile

As Dr. Attia explains, conversations about nutrition are premature until these core physical metrics are met. I keep these metrics in mind for myself as well as for those I’m seeking advice from (who haven’t written books, or done extensive research in this area).

I tested the criteria out myself back on EP 252[vi] “Using Neuroscience to Improve Fitness, Longevity and Overall Health” 3 years ago. Looking at these numbers now, my VO2 max is the same, I can still dead lift my body weight, and wall sit for 2 minutes, but dead hang for 1 minute, I’m not sure about. I’ll need to try this one to see if I can still do this. Can you do these items suggested by Peter Attia?

Peter Attia calls exercise the "single biggest elixir for brain health"[vii] because of its wide-ranging impact on numerous bodily systems, including glucose disposal, insulin sensitivity, and inflammation. While sleep and nutrition are also crucial, Attia argues that exercise's ability to positively affect so many systems makes it the most powerful single intervention. He suggests that just three hours of exercise a week is beneficial, with seven hours offering even greater rewards. It is surprising if you have the ability to track your workouts to know this number. Since I’m a huge fan of Dr. Attia’s work, and use exercise to stay on track with mental and physical health, I was surprised when I asked my Whoop device to see exactly how many hours/week I was actually logging on this important health staple.

I’m above what Dr. Attia suggests most weeks when I can fit it in. Do you know how many hours each week you spend exercising? Remember: it doesn’t have to be intense exercise to get your heart rate moving. A 30-minute walk really does move the needle for our health and wellness.

Certain wearable devices like Whoop can now measure your age, based on your activity level and certain algorithms. We will cover our interview with Whoop’s Kristin Holmes on a future review, but for now, measuring these metrics can show you in real time whether your activity is helping you to turn back the hands of time, or move it forward.

WHOOP Age, a metric provided by the WHOOP[viii] fitness tracker, is calculated based on a proprietary algorithm that takes into account various health and fitness data.

Data Considered:

Sleep duration and consistency Heart rate data (including time spent in different heart rate zones) Strength training activity Steps Resting heart rate VO2 Max (estimated) Lean body mass (if available)

Algorithm:

The algorithm uses these data points to estimate a physiological age that reflects the user's overall health and fitness level. This number is based on research into healthy aging and mortality risk factors.

Just by watching these numbers, and making sure I’m getting enough sleep and exercise, I’ve been able to move my aging needle back 4.3 years younger.

VIDEO 1 Click Here to Watch

Which takes us to our first clip, where Dr. Ratey covers the topic of fat phobia (related to our diet) in the United States. He says:

“In the U.S. we have what we call fat phobic. You know that fats were bad. Cholesterol, high cholesterol is killing us…that we should avoid fats and eat sugar or eat glucose and starch. And this has led to where we are at now where we have the obesity crisis and the diabetes type 2 crisis and heart disease and Alzheimers …it makes us less healthy to pack on all the glucose that we eat. We love it. We’re addicted to it and we have to bring that under control. And like your friend with the keto diet (Jason Wittrock from EP 94[ix]) that’s a radical departure from our current dietary preferences. Think about it…all of the quick foods. The foods that are so inviting (potato chips, Doritos, all that stuff is carbs.”

Dr. John Ratey on Fat, Sugar, and Modern Nutrition

In this first clip, Dr. Ratey discussed how, in the U.S., we’ve developed a fear of fats while embracing sugar and processed carbs.

“In the U.S., we have what we call ‘fat phobic.’ We thought fats were bad—cholesterol was killing us—and that we should avoid fats and eat glucose and starch. This has led to where we are now: obesity, type 2 diabetes, heart disease, and even Alzheimer’s.”

He emphasizes that our addiction to sugar and preference for quick, processed foods and snacks have contributed to today’s major health crises. Ratey calls for a radical shift in dietary habits—similar to what Jason Wittrock discussed in Episode 94[x] —with the focus of bringing our glucose intake under control.

Get your “exercise house” in order. Before debating which diet is best, make sure you’re moving consistently. Test yourself on Dr. Attia’s Rule:

Can you hang from a bar for 1 minute? Can you wall sit for 2 minutes? Can you deadlift your body weight for 10 reps? How’s your cardiovascular fitness (VO₂ max)? If not there yet—set small, measurable goals for each one and track your progress weekly.

Rethink your relationship with sugar. Dr. Ratey reminded us that sugar is addictive and deeply embedded in modern diets. Start by:

Replacing one processed snack a day with a whole-food option (like nuts, fruit, or yogurt). Using the “half rule”: fill only half your plate with carbs and balance the rest with protein and healthy fats.

We covered this topic on EP 275[xi] “The Damaging Impacts of Sugar on the Brain and Body” where we learned that “sugar in the brain looks like Alzheimer’s in the brain” and I even wore a glucose monitor at the time of writing this episode.

Some other tips for evaluating your relationship with sugar:

LEARN WHAT FOODS ARE LOW-GLYCEMIC and replace what you used to eat (that spiked your blood sugar) with something else that doesn’t. I found some great resources for low glycemic foods from Dr. Daniel Amen.[xii] DISCOVER THE MEAL PLAN THAT MAKES YOU FEEL THE BEST: Our body is our biggest guide. Learn to tap into how you feel after you eat certain foods. READ LABELS Read Labels and Know How to Identify Sugar to Make Better Choices: It’s shocking how many foods have hidden sugars. Did you know “The average American consumes 150 lbs. of sugar a year” (Dr. Amen) This makes sense when there’s so many foods labeled as healthy, with hidden sugars added.

Don’t fear healthy fats. Instead of avoiding fats altogether, focus on the quality:

Add omega-3s (salmon, walnuts, flaxseeds). Use olive oil or avocado oil instead of processed vegetable oils. Include whole-fat versions of yogurt or dairy in moderation—they’re more satiating and help control sugar cravings.

This one was eye-opening for me when I first started to follow Jason Wittrock in 2016, and watched what he was eating on a daily basis. I started to model his breakfast, lunches and dinners, and let go of my fear that eating foods that are high is fats (like avocado) would make me fat.

Prioritize consistency over perfection. Neither Attia nor Ratey promotes an all-or-nothing mindset. Aim for steady habits:

Walk daily or get 30 minutes of moderate activity. Eat balanced meals most of the time—then enjoy treats guilt-free. Sleep, hydration, and stress management matter just as much as diet and exercise.

Finding the balance is the key. Some days that I can’t fit exercise in, I can always find 30 minutes for a walk at some point.

Track your feedback loop. Notice how your body and brain respond when you move more and eat less sugar.

Do you sleep better? Is your focus or mood improved? Are your energy levels steadier throughout the day? Your results—not diet trends—should guide your next steps.

This is extremely noticeable for me. I just feel “right” when I’ve got this balanced, and “off” when I don’t. I know that our body is our greatest guide, and I’ve learned to listen to it.

VIDEO 2 Click Here to Watch

In our second video clip, Dr. John Ratey highlights the top three factors that most impact healthy aging and brain longevity:

He shared “what to do as an anti-aging push, exercise is at the top, right beneath that is diet and right alongside that is being connected to others. Those are the three and there are other wellness levers (like sleep and being outside, being in nature) it’s great when you can do that. The whole science of wellness really took off in the 1990saround exercise and diet came along with it. Authors like Michael Pollen.”

🧬 Dr. Ratey’s Three Keys to Anti-Aging and Lifelong Wellness

Exercise – “At the top,” he says. Physical movement remains the strongest lever we have to slow aging, boost cognition, and protect the brain. Diet – Nutrition directly affects inflammation, metabolism, and mental sharpness. Connection with others – Social interaction and belonging help regulate stress hormones and keep the brain resilient.

He also adds that other wellness levers—like sleep and time in nature—play important supporting roles. As Ratey explains, the science of wellness really began expanding in the 1990s, alongside the work of authors like Michael Pollan, who helped bridge the gap between nutrition, lifestyle, and health.

Move every day—especially in ways you enjoy.

Combine aerobic workouts (for heart health) with resistance training (for strength and metabolism). Even short bouts of walking—count.

Eat “real food.”

Follow Michael Pollan’s simple advice: “Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants.” Choose whole, unprocessed foods over packaged or refined ones.

Stay socially connected.

Make time for meaningful conversations daily. Join a workout class, hobby group, or volunteer program—social + movement = double brain benefit. Andrew Huberman[xiii] suggests texting someone even a quick hello, every morning.

Prioritize recovery (which is a whole other wellness staple we will cover later).

Aim for 7–9 hours of sleep. Unplug regularly and spend time outdoors to lower cortisol and restore attention.

Think of wellness as a system. None of these work in isolation—exercise supports sleep, which supports mood, which improves relationships. It’s all interconnected.

VIDEO 3 Click Here to Watch

🧩 Dr. Ratey on Exercise and Social Connection

In this third clip, Dr. John Ratey explains another powerful benefit of physical activity — it actually makes us more social.

“Exercise makes us more social. Not only are we able to think better and manage our emotions better, but we are more social after we exercise for multiple reasons — because we get our brain queued up, we’re better attended, we are more motivated, and we also release the bonding hormone oxytocin. It’s a powerful hormone that helps us feel connected to others. If you’re connected and you’ve exercised, you have a powerful change in brain chemistry that helps you learn better — socially, cognitively, and emotionally.”

Dr. Ratey reminds us that movement primes the brain — it wakes up attention, improves mood, and releases hormones that encourage bonding and connection. This explains why workouts, group runs, or even walking meetings often lead to deeper conversations and stronger relationships.

Move with others.

Join a workout class, a hiking group, or a neighborhood walking club. Even a quick morning walk with a friend can spark connection and consistency.

Use exercise as a social icebreaker.

Invite a coworker for a “walk and talk” meeting. Suggest family bike rides or weekend hikes to replace screen time.

Pay attention to your mood post-exercise.

Notice how you feel more open, calm, or talkative after moving — that’s oxytocin at work. Use that window of connection to reach out, share gratitude, or strengthen relationships.

Combine learning with movement.

Listen to podcasts, audiobooks, or language lessons while walking — pairing physical activity with learning enhances memory and focus.

Think “connection” as a core fitness goal. Just as you track steps or heart rate, track how often you connect meaningfully with others through movement. Social fitness matters as much as physical fitness.

As we wrap up this episode with Dr. John Ratey, we reviewed three important clips that highlight how exercise, nutrition, and social connection work together to support brain health and overall wellness.

We began with Dr. Peter Attia’s reminder that before debating diets or supplements, we should first get our exercise foundation in order—being able to dead hang for a minute, wall sit for two, deadlift our body weight for ten reps, and reach a VO₂ max in the 75th percentile. Then Dr. Ratey then explained how our society has become “fat phobic”—avoiding healthy fats while overconsuming sugar and refined carbs. This imbalance has led to rising rates of obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and Alzheimer’s. His message was clear: we must reduce our addiction to sugar and rebalance our nutrition toward whole, nutrient-dense foods.

Next, Dr. Ratey outlined what he calls the three biggest levers of healthy aging:

Exercise – the most powerful anti-aging tool we have. Diet – directly linked to brain and body health. Connection with others – essential for emotional and cognitive well-being. He also mentioned the importance of sleep and time in nature, reinforcing that true wellness is a system — all these areas support and amplify one another.

In our final clip, Dr. Ratey explained how exercise makes us more social. Physical activity not only boosts focus and mood but also triggers the release of oxytocin, the bonding hormone that helps us feel connected to others. When we combine movement with social interaction—like exercising with friends or joining a group activity—we strengthen our brain chemistry for learning, empathy, and connection.

Both Dr. Attia and Dr. Ratey remind us that health and brain performance begin with the basics—moving often, eating real food, resting deeply, and connecting meaningfully with others. Once these foundations are in place, the body and brain naturally function at their best.

The takeaway:

Move daily, eat mindfully, connect intentionally — and your brain will thank you.

With that, we will conclude PART 2 of our review of Dr. Ratey’s 2021 interview with a final thought from his book, Spark

“what makes aerobic exercise so powerful is that it’s our evolutionary method of generating that spark. It lights a fire on every level of your brain, from stoking up the neurons’ metabolic furnace, to forging the very structures that transmit information from one synapse to the next.”

“Exercise is the single best thing you can do for your brain in terms of mood, memory and learning. “ John Ratey.

See you the 2nd week of November for our next interview with Dr. Shane Creado and the power of our sleep.

RESOURCES:

Clip 1 Fat Phobia in the USA https://www.youtube.com/shorts/3oHXBdBAtRw

Clip 2 Dr. Ratey’s Three Keys to Anti-Aging and Lifelong Wellness

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/YQkVMt2Gs3M

Clip 3 Exercise and Social Connection https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bbB4NzsnyQ0

Original Interview https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTa1zwpQcxQ

EP 277 “Transforming the Mind Using Athletics and Neuroscience”

https://andreasamadi.podbean.com/e/brain-fact-friday-on-transforming-the-mind-using-athletics-and-neuroscience-1678411797/

REFERENCES:

[i] Neuroscience Meets Social and Emotional Learning Podcast EPISODE 116 with Best Selling Author Dr. John Ratey on “The Revolutionary New Science of Exercise and the Brain” https://andreasamadi.podbean.com/e/best-selling-author-john-j-ratey-md-on-the-revolutionary-new-science-of-exercise-and-the-brain/

[ii] Neuroscience Meets Social and Emotional Learning Podcast EPISODE #87 with Andrea Samadi on “The Top 5 Brain Health and Alzheimer’s Prevention Strategies” https://www.achieveit360.com/the-top-5-brain-health-and-alzheimers-prevention-strategies-with-andrea-samadi/

[iii] Neuroscience Meets Social and Emotional Learning Podcast EPISODE #87 with Andrea Samadi on “The Top 5 Brain Health and Alzheimer’s Prevention Strategies” https://www.achieveit360.com/the-top-5-brain-health-and-alzheimers-prevention-strategies-with-andrea-samadi/

[iv]Neuroscience Meets Social and Emotional Learning Podcast EPISODE #118 with a Deep Dive into Dr. Ratey’s books. https://andreasamadi.podbean.com/e/deep-dive-into-best-selling-author-john-j-rateys-books-spark-go-wild-and-driven-to-distraction/

[v] https://peterattiamd.com/

[vi] https://andreasamadi.podbean.com/e/brain-fact-friday-on-using-neuroscience-to-improve-fitness-longevity-and-overall-health/

[vii] Peter Attia on Exercise https://www.youtube.com/shorts/B8Jr8cV-22g

[viii] www.whoop.com

[ix]Neuroscience Meets Social and Emotional Learning Podcast EPISODE #94 “Personal Trainer and Fitness Model Jason Wittrock on Health, Nutrition, Intermittent Fasting and the Ketogenic Diet” https://andreasamadi.podbean.com/e/personal-trainer-and-fitness-model-jason-wittrock-on-health-nutrition-intermittent-fasting-and-the-ketogenic-diet/

[x] Neuroscience Meets Social and Emotional Learning Podcast EPISODE #94 “Personal Trainer and Fitness Model Jason Wittrock on Health, Nutrition, Intermittent Fasting and the Ketogenic Diet” https://andreasamadi.podbean.com/e/personal-trainer-and-fitness-model-jason-wittrock-on-health-nutrition-intermittent-fasting-and-the-ketogenic-diet/

[xi]Neuroscience Meets Social and Emotional Learning Podcast EPISODE #275 The Damaging Impacts of Sugar on the Brain and Body https://andreasamadi.podbean.com/e/brain-fact-friday-the-damaging-impacts-of-sugar-on-the-brain-and-body/

[xii] 4 Feel Better Food Strategies by Daniel Amen https://www.amenclinics.com/blog/4-feel-better-fast-food-strategies/#:~:text=Most%20vegetables%2C%20legumes%2C%20and%20fruits,blood%20sugar)%20are%20smart%20carbs.

[xiii] Dr. Andrew Huberman on the Benefits of Staying Connected https://www.youtube.com/shorts/ZFrl5XqyCfc