Once a Trump loyalist, Florida’s combative governor Ron DeSantis is now favourite to take the Republican Presidential nomination from his former patron. Running on an explosive cocktail of culture war issues and hardline governance, he could become the first Florida-born President. But what does DeSantis want? Could he defeat Trump and then Biden? And would a President DeSantis abandon Ukraine?

Michael Crick talks to Peter Feaman, a Republican lawyer who represents Florida on the RNC; Professor Michael Binder of the University of North Florida; and Ryan Wiggins of the anti-MAGA Republican group The Lincoln Project about what make DeSantis run – and how far he could go.

• “De Santis is Trump on steroids… He’s not the brightest ball in the box but his wife is driving this train – and she’s very good at it.” – Ryan Wiggins
• “If you want to be the man, sometimes you’ve got to beat The Man.” – Michael Binder
• “He’s refusing to denounce antisemitism, encouraging white supremacists, taking rights away from people of colour and LGBTQ… I don’t think it’s a stretch to call it fascism.” – Ryan Wiggins
• “DeSantis is Donald Trump 2.0. He has the same aggression and fighting spirit but a little less rough round the edges.” – Peter Feaman

Written and presented by Michael Crick. Produced by Neil Fearn. Audio production by Alex Rees. Music by Jade Bailey. Group Editor: Andrew Harrison. Mugshots is a Podmasters Production.

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