“Do not make that boat crossing. Do not make that journey. Do not pay all of your money to people smugglers and criminals.”

Nick Robinson speaks to Shabana Mahmood, British Home Secretary, about her far-reaching proposals to shake up the UK immigration system, designed to make asylum seekers think twice before attempting to enter the country illegally.

She also shares her own experience of racism as the daughter of Pakistani immigrants, and her belief that ensuring secure borders is the best way to combat this. Under her plans, refugee status will be made temporary, with frequent reviews, meaning people could be returned to their home country if it is deemed safe. Refugees will also need to live in the UK for 20 years before they can apply to stay permanently, a signifcant increase on the current five years. The removal of failed asylum seekers will be speeded up, and Shabana Mahmood is revoking the legal duty to provide them with support such as housing and money.

Thank you to the Political Thinking team for its help in making this programme. The Interview brings you conversations with people shaping our world, from all over the world. The best interviews from the BBC. You can listen on the BBC World Service on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays at 0800 GMT. Or you can listen to The Interview as a podcast, out three times a week on BBC Sounds or wherever you get your podcasts.

Presenter: Nick Robinson Producer: Lucy Sheppard and Daniel Kraemer Editor: Justine Lang

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(Image: Shabana Mahmood. Credit: Wiktor Szymanowicz/Future Publishing via Getty Images)