Jim talks with Thomas Schindler about heliogenic civilization as a vision for a regenerative future. They discuss the current multipolar trap shitshow of global civilization, M3 money supply & GDP growth requirements, the doubling of energy demand, exit to planet as an alternative to traditional business exits, biomimicry & biological approaches to manufacturing, solar energy as a fusion reactor, nature's material production vs human industrial production, construction systems using earth blocks & natural materials, bioregional self-sufficiency, feminine scaling vs traditional growth models, the Oslo Project as an inverse Manhattan Project, deep ecology & Arne Næss's philosophy, governance structures, education systems as symptoms of industry, coordination among farmers in Kenya, project governance & preventing OpenAI syndrome, Bernard Lietaer's alternative currency experiment, biological computing possibilities, solar energy & hydrogen electrolysis, ocean floor mining & environmental impacts, copper vs aluminum for electrical transmission, material constraints on renewable energy transition, and much more. Thomas Schindler's website In service of Life. | Thomas Schindler's Substack Miracle Project Auroville Earth Institute Carbon Crusher Bind-X Thomas is co-founder of delodi.net, a mission-driven software studio and the engine behind the not-for-profit initiatives MOTHERLAND, GITA, IRM, and Project MIRACLE. The throughline of his work lies in reimagining how societies generate value—shifting from extractive models to regenerative, life-centered systems that empower local communities. He’s particularly focused on helogenic civilization frameworks, bio-regional material commons, infrastructures of generosity, systemic change methodologies, and the intersections of technology, culture, and ecology. Motivated by the conviction that aligning collective creativity, open protocols, and local agency is essential to address today’s ecological and existential challenges, he writes, speaks, convenes and assemblies to catalyze these conversations and collaborations.