In this episode, Scott Black talks with poet and critic Craig Dworkin about his new book, The Sound of Thinking: A Listener’s Companion to Conceptual Music (University of Chicago Press), on music made from rules, systems, and procedures rather than personal expression. They explore pieces like György Ligeti’s 100 metronomes, Steve Reich’s swinging-microphone Pendulum Music, Enrique Udo’s braille-based scores, Johannes Kreidler’s stock-market sonifications, and an uncanny note-for-note remake of Kind of Blue.

Along the way, they discuss John Cage, the boundaries between noise and music, how listening becomes a cognitive practice, and why conceptual sound works challenge us to rethink creativity, difficulty, and the very definition of music.

Craig Dworkin is Professor of English at the University of Utah.

Episode art: Detail from Juan Gris, Le papier à musique (1913-1914), Musée National d'Art Moderne, Paris.

Episode edited by Ethan Rauschkolb. Named after our seminar room, The Virtual Jewel Box hosts conversations at the Obert C. and Grace A. Tanner Humanities Center at the University of Utah. Views expressed on The Virtual Jewel Box do not represent the official views of the Center or University.